Lets face it. I'm French so forgive me for sticking my nose in. This site is quite vitriolic. Turkey and its unrecognised criminal banana puppet state will never be accepted by EU Referendum voters to be part of the EU; unless they become civilized, acknowledge historical genocide on original inhabitants of Asia Minor and Cyprus, give full Acquis rights to Kurds and finally get rid of the hidden state and acknowledge RoC Sovereignty over whole of Cyprus, GC and TC, and let the Cypriots resolve differences on their own. This is what Greece has been doing since the restoration of Democracy on 20 July 1974.

Also for this to happen Turks have to come to terms with their cultural inferiority complex vis a vis Greeks, the Persians, Russians, Armenians and other ex-resident peoples of Anatolia before 15th, 16th century who actually form ironically 80% of Turkish blood i.e. all of you were Greek Orthodox, Syriac Orthodox to start with and converted for social or survival reasons to Islam. Original Turks who were a Mongolic race, in eveidence nowhere bt eastern Anatolian villages and have slit eyes. These people have intermixed and hardly exist nowadays, though attitudes and bloodthirstiness exists in some circles see articles on Solomos Solomou and Isaac. Denktash your Ancestors were probably Greek Orthodox or Catholic Christians before Suleiman captured Cyprus from the Latins in the 1500s. Lets not forget the Genissaries, oldest sons taken from non Islamic families and brainwashed into Turkish soldiers - their elite forces. Hope same didn't happen in Cyprus in 1974. So Turks of today, you are most likely of Greek origin anyway.

What an irony to spill blood over a cause which simple doesn't historically exist.

Emir and others, why are you so bitter I cannot understand why you have so much hatred inside you that you have to post some of the remarks that you do on this site. This also goes for some of the GC's that do the same.

Don't you all think the time is long overdue for this bickering and insults to stop. PLEASE STOP CURSING EACH OTHER! If there is a solution to the Cyprus problem then we will all be living together as Cypriots, and if there isn't a solution we are still all living together as Cypriots, as Cyprus is neither Greece nor Turkey.

I ask you Emir, do you not call yourself a Turkish Cypriot? It certainly sounds like it as you keep mentioning the TRNC and not Turkey! let's say that there is partition and the TRNC becomes recognized will you then call yourselves Turkish or Turkish Cypriots, there's that word again CYPRIOTS!

When are the rude and disruptive people from both sides going to grow up and start living their lives as caring, loving human beings, as they should be. Does not Allah and the Koran not teach these same values as well as the Bible does for the Christians?

It's the abusive people who post on this site that are one of the main reasons politician on both sides use one of the excuses of security for each community as one of the stumbling blocks to reaching a solution, among others of course.

For all our sakes and to all of you that seem to have so much hatred towards each other, please stop being abusive to each other. The time is long overdue for reconciliation and peach in Cyprus. not the kind of peace that exists today by being divided but peace and being able to live with each other.

As I stated before in one of my postings I am a Greek speaking CYPRIOT! I lived in the UK for most of my life from 1957 and when i was asked what nationality are you I would, and still do say that I am CYPRIOT! Only if I was asked Greek or Turkish I would then and only then reply that I am Greek Speaking CYPRIOT, there that word again CYPRIOT!

I also stated that I was a volunteer in the GC's army from 1973-1975, not a great period of Cyprus history. I was also very saddened to see how divided the GC's were and obviously the TC's were as well. For in the UK we lived as brothers and sisters as one Cypriot people, and I still have many TC as my close friends even on the North of Cyprus.

As I have stated atrocities had been committed by both communities towards each other and both EOKA B and the TMT killed people from their own communities for the sake of nationalism and the pathetic dream of becoming part of both of their so called motherlands. How pathetic to not be proud of our own heritage and wanting to belong to some other country.

As for how many different nationalities now live in Cyprus, what is the difference since Cyprus is part of Europe and if a solution is found or not and then TRNC is recognized will the TRNC not become part of Europe as well since Turkey is negotiating to become a member of the European Community? Since that is the case then Turkey being or Greece being a one of the guarantees for the security of Cyprus is rather ridiculous as all European countries guarantee each others security.

Let us, together, move forward and live in peace and prosperity with each other. Let reconciliation really start and Cypriots to Unite together for our children and their children and many generation thereafter. The time is long overdue for this to happen and the time is now for this to happen.

I say to Emir and others that site hatred and live in the past, let us all meet in peace and have a coffee together and see if we cannot talk with respect to each other. Let us be as one nation and one nationality for in the eand we are CYPRIOTS and nothing else!

I've marked all the comments that are homophobic.
Emir, you keep going on about homosexuality. Why? Most psychologists believe that those who bring this subject in out of nowhere are gay. Is that the case with you? Why don't you just come out of the closet and leave us alone.
There are quite a few Nazi's posting here. Figures and stats flying all over the place. I must say that Emir's stats on the 2006 ROC election made me laugh out loud. Did MIT give you those figures directly? You also seem to rejoice at the number of Cypriot Greek deaths with comments like "you started it" etc. You need some therapy and some outside exposure. Stop listening to propaganda and learn to love your neighbour. Lets mourn all those Cypriots killed by people with similar sentiments to you....

Turkey has a long history of ETHNIC CLEANSING, GENOCIDE, VIOLATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS and MURDER. The Armenian Genocide in 1915. Massacres of Kurds and Assyrians. Burning of Smyrna in 1922. Conscription Brigades of Pontian Greeks in the 1930's and 1940's. Punitive taxation of Christian 'subject peoples'. The Pogrom of ethnic Greeks in 1955. Forced emigration of ethnic Greeks in 1964. Invasion and ETHNIC CLEANSING of Cyprus in 1974.

It goes on and on. That's why they have no credibility today, their history has shown them for what they are.

JT@
If it wasn't to an Ottoman male population 400 year rule of Greece, they would have been extinct.
Why do you think, after 4000 years Greeks are still 10 million and going down?

JT & John Alexander
You 2 are biggest losers I have ever come a cross. You lost %38 of the island. Turkey didn’t open the ports airports to Greek Cyprus, 36.000 troops are still stationed here in Cyprus, 50.000 settlers are still here. Turkey doesn’t move an INCH.
What are you going to do about it?
Join the National THUGS, make sure you got your trainers and swimming trunks with you, and whatever you do don’t climb a flag poles.

Jon@ here is a nice story of a Greek who never does anything wrong, and always blame others.
'
During the Turkish war of independent, when the Greek General Papoulias' Army was defected and humiliated by Ataturk, in Sakarya 13th September 1921, with 10 000 Greek casualties,
Greek General Papoulias said ' 'Damn you Georghios'’, meaning David Lloyd George, Which was a British Prime Minister.
Why Greeks always blame others for their misdeeds and self inflicted misfortunes?

I could say exactly the same for those TCs killed in Maratha: 'it was a war, get over it, what did you expect. They were probably all TMT terrorists anyway. They got what they deserved. The only good Turk is a good Turk. Not even a dead Turk is a good Turk.' I could say this, but I won't since, unlike you, ES, I am a thinking man and not a barbarian.

WHO the hell are you? "RoC has NEVER sanctioned "
TRNC got nothing to do with RoC, you got no control over it, Oram case proved that.
JT, you are living at the La la land.
Wake up and look at the NORTH, you will see a BIG HUGE TRNC Flag.

JT@
'
"WHOLE of the Island????????????? "- %37 =%63
Makarios was Math's teacher?YOU WILL GET OVER IT
LOSERRRRRRRRRR

John Alexander you are all HOT air.
%38 of the island GONE for GOOD, and you are still spreading hate.
TRNC is here to STAY.
GET OVER IT

.

JT@ your Greek propaganda is no good anymore, World turn their heads away.
That’s why Turkish troops are still in Cyprus, and you can do nothing about it.
‘
Here is the true face of Greeks by GREEK with FULL Church teaching;
‘
YOU CAN NOT HIDE THE TRUTH ANYMORE. 30 Greek Cypriots who committed these crimes are identified and named. Watch this space.
Antonis Angastiniotis
1974 It was Greeks Cypriots who massacred Turkish villages of Aloda Maratha and Sandalari . It was The Greek Cypriots of the Neighbouring villages,along with army personnel, attacked these villages. They shot the children, the mothers and any old people of these villages, 126 people who were killed, human rights Greek activist Antonis Angastiniotis had called on the Greek Cypriot people to apologize to the Turkish Cypriot people, prosecute the culprits and pay compensation to the families of the deceased

For the sake of accuracy, it should be noted that there were approximately 6,000 Greek Cypriots killed during the Turkish invasion, and this includes the 1600+ who were declared missing after 1974 but who we are now discovering were massacred. In 1963-64, i.e. the Turkish terrorist uprising, 200 Greeks were killed and 42 are missing, while during the fighting in 1967 at Ayios Theordoros/Kophinou, two Greeks were killed. The figures for TCs are as follows. In 1963-64, 350 were killed; in 1967, 27 TCs were killed, while in 1974, 788 TCs were killed. So, all in all, we're talking about 6,500 Greeks killed and 1,150 from the Turkish minority, i.e. six times as many Greeks killed than Turks.

Someone before suggested that up to a third of these casualties on each side was self-inflicted, i.e. TMT killing Turkish Cypriots, and EOKA B killing GCs; but this is a vast exaggeration and I've no idea where this figure comes from.

Now, the main point of dwelling on these statistics is as follows: it blows out of the water the TC argument that the TC were victims of ethnic cleansing/genocide during the 1963-74 period and that, therefore, we have to look for other explanations as to why Turkey invaded Cyprus and why Turkey is still in Cyprus.

And, of course, I haven't mentioned statistics on refugees, mass rapes, looting and cultural destruction. To do so would be important because it draws attention to what the Cyprus problem is all about: it is about human rights and international law. It is not a spat between two competing ethnic groups – GCs and TCs – and that is why simply calling for better relations between Cypriots misses the point and has no real meaning. GC and the Turkish minority could get on like brothers, but this would not solve the Cyprus problem.

Diane, whilst your comments are most welcome, you state to call ourselves Cypriots which is a fact and avoid labels etc. However the turkish cypriots want to have their own state listen and will not reason. Turkey is rek nown for ethnic cleansing and genocide atrocities and then tries to lay blame on the slaughtered and raped saying they started it etc.....picking on the weak doesnt make anybody a hero nor a brave person yet the turks always end their topic of conversation with a threat. Everytime the RoC tried to improve her position in the world turkey threatened Cyprus via the puppet denktash, which to me seems extremely embarrassing from an educated man. But we must not forget denktash who se family possess the RoC ID cards and passports just like emir solar, why do they possess such legal documents because the pseudostate is not legitimate. I think I am going to set up my own state in my garden, will you second it Diane just as turkey has done for the turkish speaking Cypriots. If you stand at the greenline you can see emir solar sneaking through to come to work in the free areas and calling his boss mastro, but why waste your breath trying to educate imbiciles like him.

I have refrained from commenting on the "Cyprus Problem" simply because I don't really have enough knowledge of the subject.
What I do have knowledge about is human psychology, having studied the subject.
Do we speak of Scottish, English, Welsh and or Irish British ?
NO, they are all British.
Do they all speak,read, write the same language ?
YES.
Do they all use Roman letters to write ?
YES.
My suggestion therefore to help unite the people of north and south of Cyprus would be:
ON CYPRUS.
Replace the Cyrillic script of the Greek and Turkish languages with Roman script, as in nearly every other European country.
The people could still use their separate languages but each would be better understood by each other. Another of one of the major European languages could be adopted as the official language of Cyprus.
Forbid the "labelling" of people and the island of Cyprus as, "the Greek side" and "the Turkish side", in conversation and the written word.
The people themselves should all be called Cypriots and reply to such questions as to where they come from, with: "Famagusta on Cyprus" or "Paphos on Cyprus",stressing the fact that it is an independant island !
Cyprus is neither Greek nor Turkish it is CYPRIOT !
This would go a long way to replacing the national pride in all Cypriots and really make them feel that they "BELONG", hand-in-hand, instead of being passed like pawns in a chess game by glory-seeking-politicians !!
OK, after many years of observing the situation, that is my opinion.

Diane Best.

The only Turks who will end up with their 'heads on a plate' Trixi from Girne are those who commited crimes. If I were one of those who murdered Solomou and Isaak I would be worried. Their days running away from justice are coming to an end. The hands on the clock are moving inexorably closer to their day of reckoning. Those who have avoided justice by hiding behind the barbed wire and minefields of the Green Line are going to be apprehended and made to pay for their crimes. That I promise you. No other Turk Cypriots need be worried, they will become full citizens of the new Cyprus-eligible for all the priveleges afforded to any EU citizen.

Greek Junta and Nikos Samson gambled, Cyprus for an Enosis.
In every game you play, mistakes are costly.
So Greeks played the game and lost %37 of the Island.
Simple is that, why so much fuss?
We all have to pay cost of our mistakes.
Betting shop won’t give you money back, when you lost,

trixi thats only speculation and assumption, like I sadi previously turkey was guarantor for ALL Cypriots yet failed to stay impartial and simply ethnically cleansed, raped, stole and murdered GC's. So turkey's agreement to be a guarantor was and is always to protect only TC's and do the above to the GC's and will continue with this logic.

This is turkey's way of life, yet they deny, is this not ethnic cleansing and muder etc,,,,,,,,
Sunday, February 7, 2010
ISTANBUL - Daily News with wires
A U.S. congressional panel plans to consider a resolution to declare the World War I-era killings of Armenians a genocide. The move is likely to raise tensions with Turkey.

The U.S. House of Representatives Foreign Affairs Committee on Friday announced it had scheduled a debate on the resolution for March 4, reported The Associated Press on Friday.

Turkey has strenuously opposed previous attempts by lawmakers to declare the killings genocide. Some historians estimate that 1.5 million Armenians were killed by Ottoman Turks in 1915. The event is viewed by some scholars as genocide, but Turkey insists the death toll has been inflated.

During the last years of the Ottoman Empire, Ottoman forces reportedly killed or deported hundreds of thousands of Armenians living throughout Turkey, based on the grounds that in their struggle for independence, some Armenian groups in Turkey were cooperating with imperial powers that were at war with the Ottomans. Hundreds of thousands of Armenians are said to have died or been killed during forced deportation marches. Armenians and people around the world have characterized these events as genocide.

Armenian-American groups for years have lobbied for a resolution.

Sad..so sad.
These people were killed in the name of Greek/Turk nationalism.
Figures over the last 60 years are confusing:
Cypriot Turks murdered: 800 - 1500 (depending which side you listen to)
Cypriot Greeks murdered:2,000 - 4,000 (depending on which side you listen too)and approx 1500 missing from both communities.
We all know that about a third of each figure was murdered by their own side (EOKA-B and TMT)
The 2 extremist groups have a lot in common don't you think? They murdered people from their own community and the other in the name of some simplistic notion of nationalism and racial hatred for the other. We see this the word over.
We should all be saying that 2,800 - 5,500 innocent Cypriots were killed over the last 60 years by extremists. We should unite, learn and make sure we stop this ever happening again.
Copy pasting atrocities re Cypriot suffering in both communities to justify the very sentiment/nationalism that led to the suffering, pain and death in the first place, is pretty ridiculous. It's actually downright outrageous!
Emir/John you are the same person in my eyes. You both justify the murder of the other to defend the actions of extremists.
I for one would like to pay my respects to every single one that has been murdered in the name of fascism/nationalism regardless of ethnicity and so should all of you.

Emir 'wake up and look around you' as the song states!

Are you blind or what?

You know the story that they taught you well. Continue your story in order to be able to sleep during the night........

Today, 2010 my friend, Cyprus is occupied. If in 1974 was intervention, I hope you have the mental capability to understand that today this intervention, they call it OCCUPATION.

The right of the property is another issue. The fact is that 40% of the Cypriot owners (from both sides) can not use their property. Someone stole it from them! (temporarily of course, pay day is coming......for Orams already has come and for the Orams-like soon.......everybody will get what he/she deserves)

THE PROBLEM WITH MOST OF THE TURKS IS THAT THEY LIVE NEAR WHERE HAMURABI LIVED AND GOT INFECTED! YOU ARE PROVING ONCE MORE THAT YOU ARE NOT A EUROPEAN NATION BUT RATHER A TRUE BELIEVER OF HAMURABI LAW.....a law that was presented in 1800 BC (that's 4000 years ago). This is where you live.

Few examples of the Hamurabi laws (the law that apparently many Turks live with, still today, after 4000 years):
>If a man kills another man's son his son shall be cut off.
>If a man puts out the eye of an equal, his eye shall be put out.
>If a man knocks the teeth out of another man, his own teeth will be knocked out.

THE FUNNY THING, IS THAT YOU BELIEVE IN HAMURABI LAW, BUT YOU COPY WHATEVER SUITS YOU. IF YOU HAVE FOLLOWED ALL HAMURABI LAWS......then you would have seen that there is a Hamurabi law that states:
>If anyone commits a robbery and is caught, he shall be put to death.

----> So, now you know what would have happened to Orams 9and their like) if they lived during Hamurabi times

AS A CYPRIOT I DO NOT BELIEVE NEITHER IN HAMURABI LAWS NOR I LIVE IN A FANTASY WORD OF PROPAGANDA. CYPRUS JOINED EUROPEAN UNION IN ORDER TO TRY TO BECOME MORE FREE FROM ANY WRONG DOINGS OF THE PAST AND BECOME A TRUE EUROPEAN DEMOCRATIC CIVILIZED COUNTRY. THE FRAMEWORK OF EU IS THERE AS WELL AS ITS LAWS.

Stop trying to justify today occupation, with all those stories that Turks were the innocent. If you want history, then lets talk history.......where it starts as far as Turks is concerned in this area of the world, once they came and killed and raped and conqur, all the countries around today Turkey.

PS. HELLO.....THE CIVILIZATION OF ALL THE NATIONS AROUND TURKEY GOES THOUSAND OF YEARS BACK......YOU ARE ONLY THE RECENT HISTORY OF GREECE and the Balkans and the Kurds and Iran!!

Christoph from USA @ WHO IS ALWAYS ECONOMICAL WITH TRUTH, It must be the Church teaching, to hate OTHERS.
'
You said, Turkey was trying to justify Cyprus invasion?

I always back up my claims,

'
The historical decision of the Athens Court of Appeals, No. 2658/79, dates back to March 21, 1979.

Turkey’s July 20, 1974 intervention on Cyprus was legal, say the Athens Court of Appeals and the Council of Europe.
The Council of Europe adopted Resolution 573 on July 29, 1974 on this particular case, stating that Turkey’s intervention on Cyprus was a legitimate act emanating from the Treaty of Guarantee, Part IV.

On July 15, 1974, the junta ruling Greece implemented a coup d’etat on Cyprus, overthrowing the elected government of President Makarios, which had been in control since the independence of the Republic of Cyprus in 1960. On July 20 of the same year Turkey staged a military intervention to reverse the coup.

Turkey’s action was perfectly legitimate and understandable. It was in fact a duty, stationed by the 1960 Constitution of the Republic of Cyprus; in Part IV of the Treaty of Guarantee, which forms part of the constitution. Cyprus was saved from being annexed by Greece and the Turkish Cypriots freed from Greek oppression.

During the 1960s and 1970s, the Western world only watched as the Turkish Cypriots were being massacred by their Greek Cypriot neighbours, with the aid of Greece, in a systematic campaign of ethnic cleansing, and did nothing.

Readng all those exagerated propaganda full of hatret from both sides make me feel sad.I come from a village called Argaki now ocupied and renamed AKSAY.There was a small minority of Turkish Cypriots and in 1963/64 intercommunal conflicts buses were sent by Denktash to tae them away.The Turkish Muchtar after confering with all the Turkish inhabitants in closed coffeeshop decided and sent the buses back empty.They felt saf and stayed and enjoyed security and freedom till the Turkish invasion.Those Turkish phanatics can now visit AKSAY and talk to he original turkish inhabitants.The Cyprus problem is Turkey wanting to control the whole of Cyprus and does it by taking to Cyprus thousands nd thousands Turkish naturalised settlers in numbers greater than the Turkish Cypriots and with the prsence of 40000 Turkish.The main land Turkish tax payers pays for it.A fedral state is the best solution for the interest of all cypriots.

Readng all those exagerated propaganda full of hatret from both sides make me feel sad.I come from a village called Argaki now ocupied and renamed AKSAY.There was a small minority of Turkish Cypriots and in 1963/64 intercommunal conflicts buses were sent by Denktash to tae them away.The Turkish Muchtar after confering with all the Turkish inhabitants in closed coffeeshop decided and sent the buses back empty.They felt saf and stayed and enjoyed security and freedom till the Turkish invasion.Those Turkish phanatics can now visit AKSAY and talk to he original turkish inhabitants.The Cyprus problem is Turkey wanting to control the whole of Cyprus and does it by taking to Cyprus thousands nd thousands Turkish naturalised settlers in numbers greater than the Turkish Cypriots and with the prsence of 40000 Turkish.The main land Turkish tax payers pays for it.A fedral state is the best solution for the interest of all cypriots.

well downer failed as our minister in australia in all portfolio's held so australia tossed him out a poor cyprus has ended up with an incompetent un envoy. sorry cyprus - both groups who are the victims of outside meddling

Good night John, it is late here. But then I suspect you have never been to Cyprus.

John, do give it a rest. I think enough sane people have made up there minds for one night. A foil to your obviously bias drivel is all I wanted to achieve. Thank you for your help.

Christoph - not quite. I heard somebody speak of witnessing somebody lining up 5 TCs and shooting them in cold blood in the village of Anafotia. I didn't have any reason to believe he wasn't truthfull. But I do believe that we have a long way before the two communities start trusting each other again. The pure irony is that Cypriots are closer to each other than they are with the people in Greece or Turkey. Same thing with Hitler's Germany. He was killing German Jews that all they ever did wrong was to be born Jewish. It was all justified down to the amount of bullets it takes to kill a human being or how many seconds to spend in the gas chamber.
Here's a nice poem for all of us here to ponder on:
First they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out because I was not a Jew. Then they came for the Communists, and I did not speak out because I was not a Communist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for me. And there was no one left to speak out for me. By, Martin Niem'ller

Christoph@ Who was your history teacher? Makarios?
Greek scorched-earth policy.
According to a number of sources, the retreating Greek army carried out a scorched earth policy while fleeing from Anatolia during the final phase of the war after each battle they lost.
"The Greek army in retreat pursued a burned-earth policy and committed every known outrage against defenceless Turkish villagers in its path".
James Loder Park, the U.S. Vice-Consul in Istanbul at the time, who toured much of the devastated area immediately after the Greek evacuation, described the situation in the surrounding cities and towns of İzmir he has seen, as follows:
"Manisa...almost completely wiped out by fire...10,300 houses, 15 mosques, 2 baths, 2,278 shops, 19 hotels, 26 villas destroyed. Cassaba (present day Turgutlu) was a town of 40,000 souls, 3,000 of whom were non-Muslims. Of these 37,000 Turks only 6,000 could be accounted for among the living, while 1,000 Turks were known to have been shot or burned to death. Of the 2,000 buildings that constituted the city, only 200 remained standing. Ample testimony was available to the effect that the city was systematically destroyed by Greek soldiers, assisted by a number of Greek and Armenian civilians. Kerosene and gasoline were freely used to make the destruction more certain, rapid and complete. Alasehir, hand pumps were used to soak the walls of the buildings with Kerosene. As we examined the ruins of the city, we discovered a number of skulls and bones, charred and black, with remnants of hair and flesh clinging to them. Upon our insistence a number of graves having a fresh-made appearance were actually opened for us as we were fully satisfied that these bodies were not more than four weeks old.The time of the Greek retreat through Alasehir.

Do I smell racism at work here - surely not.

Stories about TC's murdered are mostly myths, cooked up by Turks to justify their actions and behavior. Were some TC's murdered in Cyprus, yes. Was it anywhere near the hundreds of incidents Turks proclaim, no. Was it anywhere near the number of GC's murdered by the Turk military and paramilitaries in 1974/75, NFW.

It's just like the lies Turkey used in 1955 to incite the Turk 'street' against ethnic Greeks during the Progrom in Istanbul. The lies they used in 1964 to justify forced emigrations of ethnic Greeks. The lies they used in 1922 to cover up their burning of Smyrna.

Turks have lied so often and so many times they have no credibility left, nobody believes them anymore.

John, that type of behavior is what you'd expect out of a Turk. Who beats an unarmed man to death with iron bars but a Turk? Who shoots a man to death for placing a Cypriot flag on a pole but a Turk? Who lures a GC soldier into the Green Line feigning interest in talking to him-than shooting him-but a Turk?

We're dealing with middle east values, not western values. My one solace is when reunification happens there will be time for a lot of justice to be dispensed. Those who have commited crimes against Cypriots will be brought to justice, I promise you that. The murderers of Solomou and Isaak better be worried, we have not forgotten who they were.

Latest News:
'
30 Greek Cypriots are named and under investigation for 1974 Murataga, Sandallar and Aloda killings. 126 woman children and old people massacred.

I've resisted the temptation till now to do cut and paste jobs on the atrocities committed by the Turks during the invasion; but if we are going to have a contest as to who committed the worst atrocities in Cyprus, then I might as well start. So, here's something from Sevgul Uludag, a Turkish Cypriot journalist – and I mean a real journalist, not a clown like Lucas Charalambous – recording events in an unnamed (presumably mixed Greek/Turkish) village during the invasion in which a priest and his daughters were held prisoners in a church. Uludag interviewed a Turkish Cypriot villager, who recalls:

‘They were making announcements each night in the village… They were calling the men to go to the church… “Those who want to rape the daughters of the priest, come now!” they were saying. My father was angry and was telling me to get inside the house and remain there… 30 of them, 40 of them would go to rape the girls inside the church… They kept the priest there to watch… Now, no one pointed a gun to their heads to do this. These were the ordinary men of the village that you see every day… Later the Red Cross or some other organisation came to the village to take the girls. The girls were brought outside on stretchers; they were covered in blood and they were taken away. I remember those announcements, people going round the houses and saying, “Who wants to come tonight?” Now if we told these stories, imagine how a 10-year-old boy who loves his chubby grandfather and finds out that he had been part of the raping of the girls in the church, would feel… How his world will be crushed if he finds out that in fact his grandfather had killed seven or eight persons.’

Bravo Demitris a whiff of common sense - i likewise do not wish to offend those who lost loved ones on both sides,but the whole thrust of the talks is to move foreward to a future and whatever was done in the past cannot be changed - it is history.
There is a saying in northern countries, "forgive, but never forget". the people of Cyprus deserve better politicians than the bunch they have now.This country needs Mandelas not morons.

There was a massacre at Maratha. There was no 'intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group'. This is obvious. Any idiot can see this. You're just being obtuse because you are intellectually, politically and emotionally incapable of dealing with the real 'intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnic, racial or religious group', which was the genocide Greeks were subjected to as a result of the Turkish invasion. If you want to turn the Cyprus issue into a contest as to who performed the worst atrocities, fine, I have no problem with this, the evidence overwhelmingly reveals that the invasion was another example of sadistic Turkish barbarism.

As for the intercommunal violence in the 1960s: the Turks start a terrorist war aimed at bringing about partition – which is predicated on the genocide of the Greeks of northern Cyprus – the legitimate authorities respond to this violent uprising, in which Turkish terrorists deliberately expose their own people to Greek reprisals because they hope to prompt a Turkish invasion, and then you call this 'genocide'. Truly bizarre. If anyone's to blame for TC civilian casualties in 1963-64 it is the terrorist TMT and Turkey who regarded the TCs as expendable in their overall plan to partition Cyprus. Certainly, Greeks treated the Turkish minority with kid gloves in the 1960s and paid the price for their naivety in 1974. In my view, Greeks should have been much tougher in putting down the Turkish onslaught in the 1960s.

With no intention of offending anyone who lost loved ones during the war, I believe we have to move on and put these stories behind us. Living in hatred does no good to anyone. There is no dignified or justifiable cause for killing innocent civilians.

BY WORLD PRESS
“But gentlemen, the problem is settling itself”
From New York Times 16 February 1964
BLOOD STAINED ARCHBISHOP AND HIS BLOOD STAINED DOGS OF WAR
“We shall keep the Cyprus question open and will never close it under any circumstances or conditions until we close it through union with Greece, a genuine ENOSIS without exchanges” Makarios Greek Cypriot press 17/3/1965
“… Greek cruelties in Cyprus: Greeks have started an attack on the areas where the Turks are living. The Turks are trying to escape from the Greek attacks, 25,000 Turks have already been forced to leave their homes ….”
Daily Express 28 December 1963
“I was allowed to move through the whole besieged Turkish sector. I was taken to Kumsal district. into a green and white house …. The bathroom of this house was a blood-soaked shambles with women and three small boys lying dead huddled together in the bath, and in an adjoining room an other dead woman”. (Photo of the children in the bath on the first page)
Daily Mail 29 December 1963
“…. Archbishop Makarios, robed and bearded cleric who serves as President of Cyprus, has Byzantine talent for equitation…. His government deliberately provoked the clashes and is bent upon the extermination of Turkish population…
Robert H. Estabrooh Washington Post
16 – 2 – 1964
“The Imam of Omorphita and his paralyzed blind son were found today murdered in their beds in Nicosia. Turks returning to Omorphita suburb under British escort found the 75 year old priest. Huseyin Igneci riddled with machine – gun bullets.
Bernard Jordan Daily Mail 3 -1 – 1964
“In Cyprus the terror continues Right now we are witnessing the exodus of Turks from villages. Thousands of people are abandoning their homes, lands, herds: Greek terrorism is relentless. This time, the rhetoric of the Hellens and the busts of Plato do not suffice to cover up their barbaric and ferocious behavior. At four o’clock in the afternoon curfew is imposed on the Turkish villages. Threats, shootings and attempts of arson start as soon as it becomes dark. After the massacre during the past Christmas that spared neither women, nor children, it is difficult to put up any resistance” Giorgio Bocco IL GIORNO 14 – 01 – 1964 … The Constitution gives the Turkish community certain social guarantees. It is a pity that these guarantees were not enough to prevent bloodshed. These guarantees were not enough, specially if the President (Makarios) continues to insist in abolishment of the constitutional rights of the Turks, will have to be safeguarded with more efficient means …”
The Times 04 – 01 – 1964
“One of Packard’s first tasks was to try to find out what had happened to the 25 Turkish hospital patients. Secret discussions took place with a Greek Minister in the collapsed government. After a brief investigation, he was able to confirm local rumors. It appeared that Greek medical staff had slit the Turkish patient’s throats as they lay in their beds. Their bodies were loaded on to a truck and driven to a farm north of the city where they were fed into mechanical choppers and ground into the earth”. From the “Secret” report of Commander Packard, who was a high ranking British Officer in Cyprus during 1963-1964?
The Guardian 02 – 04 – 1988
Turkish Cypriots taken prisoner and later shot in the head by Greek and Greek Cypriot gunmen.
“… If Turkish Army has not already landed reinforcements to its Treaty Force in Cyprus, that is simply proof of patience of Turkey. Its right to do so cannot be denied. If international treaties mean anything, Turkey can protect the Turkish Cypriot minority from further massacre.”
Daily Telegraph 15/02/1964

JOHN
So there where no GC/s killed by other GC's between the coup and the Turkish intervention, and that intervention saved many GC lives.

Of cause there were casualties during the peace mission, Turks as well as GC's. But it stopped the Genocide against Turkish Cypriots stone dead, and has continues to do so to this day.

How does the massacre at Maratha fit in with definition of genocide provided? It doesn't at all. It was an isolated incident carried out by EOKA-B criminals – EOKA-B being the terror group supported by the Athens junta and the CIA, which had no support among the general Cypriot population – and was prompted by the Turkish invasion of the island. Certainly, the systematic and deliberate attempt to wipe out the Greeks of northern Cyprus – with massacres, mass rapes, looting, cultural destruction and deportations – fits precisely with the definition of genocide. The genocide of Greeks in Cyprus was not the first Turkey carried out in the 20th century – by 1974, Turkey had great experience of genocide – nor is it the first genocide Turkey has denied or sought to cover up by claiming that it was Turks who were the real victims of this sub-human violence.

And again: if the killings of 120 Turks from Maratha constitutes 'genocide'; how would you define the slaughter of 6,000 Greeks in Cyprus during the Turkish invasion?

Mr Alexander

Numbers make no difference as follows: -

The crime of "genocide" defined in international law

The international legal definition of the crime of genocide is found in Articles II and III of the 1948 Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of Genocide.

Article II describes two elements of the crime of genocide:

1) the mental element, meaning the "intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such", and

2) the physical element which includes five acts described in sections a, b, c, d and e. A crime must include both elements to be called "genocide."

Article III described five punishable forms of the crime of genocide: genocide; conspiracy, incitement, attempt and complicity.

Excerpt from the Convention on the Prevention and
Punishment of Genocide (For full text click here)
"Article II: In the present Convention, genocide means any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:

(a) Killing members of the group;

(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm to members of the group;

(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;

(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;

(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

Article III: The following acts shall be punishable:

(a) Genocide;

(b) Conspiracy to commit genocide;

(c) Direct and public incitement to commit genocide;

(d) Attempt to commit genocide;

(e) Complicity in genocide. "

It is a crime to plan or incite genocide, even before killing starts, and to aid or abet genocide: Criminal acts include conspiracy, direct and public incitement, attempts to commit genocide, and complicity in genocide.

Therefore the x3 villages mentioned can be deemed as being an act of Genocide.

I trust you will find this information of value & in the meantime should you require any further clarifications please do not hesitate to ask.

Latest News
1974 barbarism against the innocent Turkish Cypriots by Greek Cypriot thugs in Murataga, Sandallar and Aloda, which 126 woman children and old people massacred.
After years of investigation, number of Greek Cypriots who carried out these crimes identified and named. Some still live in South of Cyprus but some moved to other countries.
Families who lost their loved ones with the help Human Rights Organisation will press charge for war crimes and mass murder and crimes against humanity in Hague, within next few months.

True to form then John - keep it up we might even get a few GC's seeing what a clown you are.

Who the hell is JD Bowers? It's hilarious the lengths the Turkish occupation regime will go to find someone to back up their ludicrous allegations regarding ethnic cleansing and genocide. What do you think? You slip some idiot a few lira, invite him for a holiday to Kyrenia, get him to say what you want to hear, and we're all supposed to be impressed. Don't be so stupid. Next, you'll be referring us all to The Genocide Files. Don't you realise how ridiculous you are? The Turks do exactly the same when it comes to denying the Armenian Holocaust. They dig up some pro-Turk 'scholar' who they've liberally funded and flattered and present him as an authority when all he is is a paid stooge for Turkey's propaganda. The whole world knows that the only ethnic cleansing that occurred in Cyprus was that suffered by 200,000 Greeks forced from their homes by the Turkish invasion in 1974. And just for the record: how many TCs did Samson and EOKA-B kill in this imaginary 'genocide' of the TCs? I'm sure it's really easy for you to answer this question, given all the 'eyewitness accounts' and 'factual documents'. Come on: what are the numbers?

A number of us TC's and Brits from the TRNC now only post on these sites and forums to show outsiders what lying idiots you are. I will not call you murderers because it was probably your fathers that were responsible. Nor is there any point in stating undeniable truths backed up by eyewitness accounts and factual documents because you brush anything a side that does not suit you as propaganda and worse. But if a few fair minded soles take the time to enquire independently then we are content.
So keep up your poisonous drivel and explain this.

J.D. Bowers, the international authority and respected American professor of genocide studies at Northern Illinois University, openly confirms that Greek Cypriots and EOKA-B, under the leadership of Nikos Sampson, were guilty of the genocide of Turkish Cypriots within the 1963 United Nations definition of “genocide”

I wait with bated breath.

Well, Christoph, you are one of so many prone to wishful thinking.Do you really believe that statements such as " Nobody wants them, go home" have any effect?
The reality is that they are very much wanted and most of them will only leave once the TRNC will not need them any more, like it or not.

Troodo is offended to hear the reality that Turks commited ethnic cleansing and land theft in north Cyprus but there it is. Every EU court property settlement has reaffirmed that. Time for Turkish military to see the light and get out of north Cyprus, lock-stock and barrel. Nobody wants them, go home.

Downer is a diplomat, what you GC's need is a kindergarten teacher.

You could keep asking the UN to change their representative until you get someone who will do everything you tell him, but I doubt that anyone would be daft enough to accept.

There is a story a lady was mixing the flour in old times, her in laws dislike her.In laws all the time searched for a reason to criticize the lady. One day when mother in law could not find any reason to criticize her, She said why Ur body was moving while U was mixing the flour (mean criticize for nothing) same case is with Greek Cypriots, they search for reason to fight, flag issue and now the meeting prob. They must know they can't get exactly what they like.
Give and Take is always to solve the Problems but here they just want to to Take.
Turkish army sud leave
settlers sud leave
Property sud b given back
presidency sud b the right of greeks only
In other way they r conveying the msg that We GC don't want to solve the Problem

You're all missing the point of the article. Downer is supposed to be impartial but the indications are that he has a hidden agenda to resolve the Cyprus problem on behalf of (and to the advantage of) the major western powers. The Greens, EVROKO and DISY have awoken to that fact.
Christofias and Talat are mere pawns in the game.

To David Shiambi, yes it does matter where Downer meets Talat. It gives him a legitimacy, that as of today, only Turkey recognises. Why did'nt the peoples of Europe during the second world war not recognise the NAZI Governors, because they were a brutal occupying regime that had no legal or moral authority.

As to Dave from Brdx, you got some nerve to come on this forum and start blaming the Greeks. The British screwed this country over and over,and over, so they can have a toe hold in the East Med.

The Turk way of doing things is always take what's others, Mr. Soler. Turk military should get out of northern Cyprus, give back the land they stole.

How childish these GREEK Cypriots are!! who cares WHERE they met, the guy was only trying to help (and by Christ they need it) there will never be a solution at the rate these sham of talks are going. i'm starting to think the Greeks like things the way they are, after all it gives them something to MOAN about. this was all set up just to stop turkeys EU bid nothing more nothing less.
after over 60 meetings of failure cant be wrong. facts are facts Greeks don't want to live with Turks, and vise versa. lets just keep it as it is, compensate each sides people's for their land loss and be done with it. and before i get all the normal attacking comments from gc's I AM A GC. and have a LOT of land in the north. but cant see an end to it as OUR politicians DONT WANT IT TO HAPPEN!!!!!

It must be the children of these politicians that post on the Cyprus forum.

UN Special Adviser Alexander Downer will be glad to read this article,I sure,
Once again, Greek way of doing things, "ALWAYS BLAME OTHERS"